Why did Keith refuse to sing a single song on anything to promote CH

  • October 29, 2015 at 4:04 pm #25758
    keefriffhards
    Participant

    I’m surprised Keith has done nothing but do chat shows to promote CH, no tour not even a single performance of a single song from the album.

    October 29, 2015 at 4:24 pm #25761
    treaclefingers
    Participant

    I hate to say it, but I don’t think he has the confidence to ‘carry’ an entire show himself any more.

    October 29, 2015 at 4:26 pm #25762
    stonehearted
    Participant

    In order to “refuse” something, one first has to be asked. Perhaps you are referring to that award show for blues or jazz or whatever that he appeared on recently? They knew they were getting him for 2 songs, so they weren’t about to say, “Hey, Keith, why don’t you play us 2 songs nobody knows from your new album? So that way when people tell their friends about the show, they won’t be able to name the songs you played.” Yeah, that would work.

     

    Besides, one of the two best songs on the new album requires another singer to duet with, that one he did with Nora Jones. I forget the name of it, wait, let me check the CD… hold on a sec… all this clutter all over my desk, I know I set it aside here in one of the drawers to my left… CDs everywhere, hmmm…. Well, I seem to have misplaced it. Anyway, that new song with Nora Jones is really good.

    October 29, 2015 at 4:28 pm #25763
    Cocaine Eyes
    Participant

    My guesses/thoughts are twofold: He’s concentrating on the Stones for 2016 and touring requires weeks of rehearsals followed by months of travelling and setting up. Even if he did only two shows for CH, it would still involve a great deal of work. I would have pretty much killed to see the Winos in Toronto. But I’m still betting on (?????) the Stones at Massey Hall in my future.

    ~CE

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    October 29, 2015 at 4:40 pm #25767
    StrongBeach
    Participant

    My understanding is that CROSSEYED HEART was recorded over several years, that it involves some pretty heavy layering of tracks, and that Keith himself plays many of those layers. It wasn’t the kind of record where five guys locked themselves in a studio, learned all their parts, and more or less recorded together in a fairly short period of time.

    Getting a band together and arranging this material for live performance would have taken a lot more rehearsal time than Keith was probably willing to give. For a tour, the demands are even heavier: Keith’s band hasn’t played together in over 20 years. It wouldn’t have been like The Stones getting together for a week or two to run through the same two dozen songs they’ve been playing forever.

    None of this is impossible, of course; it just seems like Keith didn’t want to go down that road. He got his album out, took a nice victory lap, and is now most likely relaxing before the ramp-up for So America.

    October 29, 2015 at 5:47 pm #25774
    keefriffhards
    Participant

    well i kind of don’t go along with most of your thoughts on this one, treacklefingers probably has it right, its all about confidence with keith and if it don’t fall into his lap, he kind of thinks, oh well just chill for a bit and wait for SA in the new year.

    I disagree with cocaine eyes, ( that’s a damn good picture of Keith you have there ) he certainly had the time to do a mini tour, and he was hot to trot from the Stones Zip code shows , he was tour ready. or as tour ready as a 72 year old man gets imho

     

    My take on this is a bit of a negative one, keith had been relatively sober over the last few years, but seemed to be knocking back the Vodka and sunkust in all the interviews to promote Crosseyed heart, drinkers are in the drink, or they are not, and i think Keith lost all motivation to tour once he started boozing again.. ( I got some serious flack for suggesting Keith was drinking on iorr. Go figure, keith of all people drinking is not tabloid press material )

     

    longbeach, keith seemed to be playing the new tracks pretty good  from what i could tell on the under The Influence documentary, so i don’t buy into the songs being too awkward, layered or insular for him too play live

    Hey never mind, maybe he will hit the road with the Wino’s when the stones are done, or when Mick can no longer do his thing, its more likely that Keith’s time has run out now, as far as solo playing goes, its so much easier to play with the Stones. Its a pity because i’m loving CH

     

    October 29, 2015 at 6:12 pm #25777
    D
    Keymaster

    Interesting take on the alcohol btw.  You might be onto something.  I’d venture to say that the prep work for the shows isn’t so much on the band, so much as on Jane etc to get everything setup.  There is certainly demand for Keith/Stones gigs…  It is not a hard sell.  Its an issue, in my mind, of logistics…

    Keith’s album has been ready for a while.  He did not write it overnight or while touring.  It has been mostly done for quite some time.  During the past tour, Keith’s marketing machine (Stones marketing machine) has been planning and dealing with everything having to do with the Stones.  In order to plan a Keith solo tour, it would require time set aside to execute all the details.  That didn’t happen.

    So the plan was from the beginning for Keith to release his album after the Stones concluded their US leg of the tour.  The album comes out, and the question is “does Keith want to go full steam into a solo tour?”.  I am betting the answer is no.  He is obviously up for doing a few isolated performances, maybe more, who knows, but not a full tour.

    Take heart btw…  A Keith solo tour is likely an end-game.  If the Stones are finished, Keith/Ronnie etc will do their own projects.  Since Keith is not going on tour, it leaves the schedule open for more important events…  Studio time and Stones gigs.

    Just my two cents.

    October 29, 2015 at 6:33 pm #25780
    keefriffhards
    Participant

    To my mind, creatively, solo Keith is just as important as another Stones ( Mick Jagger solo production album ) album.

    I want it, and i would love them to do shows promoting a new Stones album, maybe with Keith doing so well with CH it will inspire Mick to start his creative juices flowing again.

    October 29, 2015 at 6:33 pm #25781
    andrew t
    Participant

    LongBeach’s take on it feels right to me. Honestly, I doubt he could pull it off. There’s a reason he did two Stones songs at the Apollo. He’s been playing them all year. And even then, there were some gaps in the performance. And really the band did all the heavy lifting. It was an extension of his two song Stones set, except with Gimme Shelter, which he didn’t even sing lead vocal on. With Crosseyed Heart, who knows how many takes, and how much judicial editing, made those pieces come together, over many years, and that’s under perfect studio conditions. To bash that out live for 90 minutes….I just can’t see it. He can still put a smile on our faces with the Stones, but there are people old enough to drink now that weren’t born when the Winos toured last. I think that ship has sailed.

     

    October 29, 2015 at 7:15 pm #25790
    keefriffhards
    Participant

    Yes that ship has sailed, your right, i am a kieth fanatic and thought the lion would roar one more time but  basically he backed  ( of course at 71 he has every reason to back out he owe’s us nothing, he already gave it all ) out big time, not even singing one performance of a single track from CH . I was gutted, i saw the Wino’s at the first show at the Town and Country Club in 92′  and keith just blew me away, i would give my left nut to see him play like that again, even with lots of mistakes. The voice is better now but sadly his timing has gone since the bang on the head..

    October 29, 2015 at 7:57 pm #25799
    Naturalust
    Participant

    I think it’s pretty obvious after watching Keith Apollo performance why we are not seeing him out doing Crossdressed Fart songs. (sorry I couldn’t resist after hearing the joke elsewhere).  He isn’t capable of truly doing the songs live. Sadly, I doubt any reasonable amount of rehearsal would allow him to do the songs the justice they deserve. These studio pieces were done over a period of years, made of multiple takes, multiple Keith instrumental tracks and probably edited and tweaked more than we imagine to get the results we hear on the record. In order for Keith to make them sound vocally good enough he would likely have to get other folks to play ALL the parts he did in the studio…and even then…… I think his pride prevents him from showing that kind of vulnerability not only to his fans but also to his fellow musicians. When you listen to the tracks they require a level of singing and playing at the same time that Keith has not demonstrated the ability to accomplish for a long time. Why even risk the possibility of reducing the impact of these tunes with the possibility of questionable performances? If anything he is the victim of his own successful studio techniques and the great results they achieved on this record.

    Sorry to be so frank but this has nothing to do with being too concentrated on 2016 Stones performances, he likely won’t be even thinking about that till January 2016 and they have played those songs so many ties before they should have no problem with a couple weeks of rehearsals prior to the shows. We all know what the setlists will be.  He had plenty of time to put a couple shows or even short performances together this year.  It’s obvious the other players were more than available and probably would have dropped any other commitments to play with Keith anyway. Keith knew he wasn’t able to front a band without considerable risk to his reputation and even that of the new record and wisely chose to leave these songs as purely studio tracks, imo.  No worries, I just hope he is able to keep it together for the next Stones tour. That’s good enough for me.

    October 29, 2015 at 8:25 pm #25813
    keefriffhards
    Participant

    I think it’s pretty obvious after watching Keith Apollo performance why we are not seeing him out doing Crossdressed Fart songs. (sorry I couldn’t resist after hearing the joke elsewhere). He isn’t capable of truly doing the songs live. Sadly, I doubt any reasonable amount of rehearsal would allow him to do the songs the justice they deserve. These studio pieces were done over a period of years, made of multiple takes, multiple Keith instrumental tracks and probably edited and tweaked more than we imagine to get the results we hear on the record. In order for Keith to make them sound vocally good enough he would likely have to get other folks to play ALL the parts he did in the studio…and even then…… I think his pride prevents him from showing that kind of vulnerability not only to his fans but also to his fellow musicians. When you listen to the tracks they require a level of singing and playing at the same time that Keith has not demonstrated the ability to accomplish for a long time. Why even risk the possibility of reducing the impact of these tunes with the possibility of questionable performances? If anything he is the victim of his own successful studio techniques and the great results they achieved on this record. Sorry to be so frank but this has nothing to do with being too concentrated on 2016 Stones performances, he likely won’t be even thinking about that till January 2016 and they have played those songs so many ties before they should have no problem with a couple weeks of rehearsals prior to the shows. We all know what the setlists will be. He had plenty of time to put a couple shows or even short performances together this year. It’s obvious the other players were more than available and probably would have dropped any other commitments to play with Keith anyway. Keith knew he wasn’t able to front a band without considerable risk to his reputation and even that of the new record and wisely chose to leave these songs as purely studio tracks, imo. No worries, I just hope he is able to keep it together for the next Stones tour. That’s good enough for me.

     

    Ok NL if i give you that and its a fair comment from you, it still does not explain why he has not done one performance from CH on any TV network or outlet. Admittedly he does two songs fairly well some nights on the current Stones tour, some convincing versions of Slipping away and before they make me run etc.

    Don’t you think he may of been capable of singing his duet with Norah Jones on prime time TV networks or better still release it as a single. I think its just plain, i can’t be bothered rather than Keith cant sing and play a couple of songs. He showed promise on the Under The Influence documentary and Keith very rarely ever plays and sings at the same time anyway.

    October 29, 2015 at 9:17 pm #25821
    Naturalust
    Participant

    Yeah riffhards,  I agree it should have been possible for him to do something from the record, perhaps a single tune like the Norah Jones duet. I would certainly have been the best way to promote the record and Keith’s whole philosophy was based on the principal of “if you can’t play the tunes live, you ain’t a band” at one time. He knows the demand was high for a CH performance, even a single song, so that’s what leads me to believe it’s more than I can’t be bothered. For christ’s sake he has been amazingly busy and active with interviews, appearances and other PR, would have been just as easy to pull out a tune if he was still capable. Sadly, I think Keith is more fragile and effected by old age and hard living that many of us are willing to admit. I saw a few signs of it in Under The Influence. Heck he might even be propped up by pharmaceuticals such as Adderall or Provigil or any one of a number of things which might help him through appearances and performances. It’s pretty rare for someone like him who has relied on some sort of drug all his life to just give it all up without help and continue to function so well. BTW: I doubt he has ever quit the alcohol, in most circles he would be called an alcoholic, people are careful not to use that term around him I notice but is it really not obvious? He drank A LOT when I briefly hung around him in the 80’s, a true professional in that regard. He is somewhat of a freak of nature of course but he’s still only human, and perhaps one who has cashed it a few too many fun chips in his ~72 years. Enjoy him while you can I say, he will probably retire from his current capacity soon, and his decline is the only reason we haven’t seen him perform CH songs, IMO. Again, sorry to be so frank but I was never much for sugar coating my opinions with fanboy blinders. I love the guy as much as any fan and am not trying to be judgmental, just truthful.

    October 30, 2015 at 4:55 pm #25923
    keefriffhards
    Participant

    Well you don’t and should not sugar coat things around me,  I know exactly what you mean about Keith in regards to medication,  I was surprised he still takes powerful anti seizure drugs,  reading the long term side effects was depressing.  I also noticed  he had some moments on the new documentary under the influence that he appeared to slow right down in his motions.  But then again you see him doing JJF on the zip code tour and he seems so energised and motivated it’s hard to believe his age.  I disagree with you about his alcoholism,  unlike Ronnie Keith can take drink or leave it,  but as he got older like in 2007  it finally caught up with him and he could hardly play some nights.  He made a remarkable comeback from 08′ to 2015 with sobriety having a lot to do with it.  Yeah he had the odd drink but every picture tells a story and he started looking good.  But look at him since the last stones shows,  I think he is a shy man underneath the bravado and he slipped into drinking with all the interviews Jane lined up for him.  As you said he should of stuck to promoting  the album with performances,  maybe a  recorded studio live type of thing showcasing most of the new material, or an unplugged version of  various tracks,  he does love that acoustic.  It could still happen he has three months until stones SA

    October 30, 2015 at 4:59 pm #25925
    Breath
    Participant

    Well you don’t and should not sugar coat things around me

    but we all have a sweet tooth for you…

    October 30, 2015 at 5:02 pm #25926
    Breath
    Participant

    after careful deliberations and thoughtful ruminating on the subject I have come to a theory on why he hasn’t done any performance promotioning for the record:

    HE DOESN’T WANNA!

    October 30, 2015 at 6:24 pm #25936
    Naturalust
    Participant

    I of course have no idea about Keith’s drinking habits (these days) except that he likes doubles and has a rider in his touring contract that the bar commodities  be available  24/hrs a day regardless of the local laws.  I would speculate that he’s still a true professional.   😉

    October 30, 2015 at 7:57 pm #25947
    stonehearted
    Participant

    I of course have no idea about Keith’s drinking habits (these days) except that he likes doubles and has a rider in his touring contract that the bar commodities be available 24/hrs a day regardless of the local laws. I would speculate that he’s still a true professional. 😉

    Just speculation on my part, but there must be something about Keith’s condition related to his fall in 2006 that wasn’t disclosed: that he may have suffered a stroke. Recall that he had to have emergency surgery to remove a blood clot from his brain–and, well, doesn’t a stroke involve a blood clot? Besides this, Keith delayed treatment for some time, and agreed to get it looked at only when it became absolutely necessary. Ron Wood was present when Keith fell, and when Ron went to assist him, ask him if he was alright, according to Ronnie, Keith just growled, “Aw, fuck off!”, and walked off into the night.

     

    A musician’s capability doesn’t just drop off all of a sudden in his early sixties. Look at Pete Townshend, still playing as well as ever at 70, and any other musician that age you can name who has remained healthy and fit. There’s a reason for Keith’s sudden diminished capacity as a musician, as well as his inability to sing and play at the same time any longer–people have been making the same observation about Dave Davies as a performer more recently.

     

    Keith shouldn’t have waited after he fell. With a stroke, time to treatment is crucial.

    October 30, 2015 at 8:04 pm #25948
    Breath
    Participant

    it was a stroke of marketing genius to suggest it was anything BUT a stroke…

    October 30, 2015 at 8:45 pm #25958
    Naturalust
    Participant

    Not sure if it was an actually blood clot in the brain or just bleeding (and pressure) in the brain with the serious possibility of a stroke. No doubt strokes can have very different effects on people depending on exactly where in the brain the blood flow is cut off and which  brain cells die. Based on reports of Keith’s head ache symptoms it was likely indeed a  hemorrhagic event, probably could be considered a stroke but only if brain cells died technically speaking. Considering how many Keith has already killed it’s highly probable the event missed any of the live ones. LOL (no I’m not a doctor but I’m married to one)

    As far as this being the reason for his reduction of skills and this not happening automatically for someone in his 70’s, perhaps true, but when you’ve lived as hard as Keith has, it’s easy to imagine that the decline could be drug and alcohol related.  But the fact that he seems to be showing some slight improvement lately does kind of point to the possibility of a mild stroke happening in Fiji.

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